dontale has adopted no words, looked up 0 words, created 0 lists, listed 0 words, written 2 comments, added 0 tags, and loved 0 words.
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Comments by dontale
Dontale commented on the word itselves
I did misused "it" in my theoretical thought on the association in using the word "itselves". "It" is actually singular and "itself" is singular. To use "itselves" as a word one most jump the line in reforming the structure of the base word in "itselves". Meaning, when "it" is used with "selves" it must be reform into a new word unrelated to the singular of "it". Therefore, "itselves" can then be applied with new meaning and by meaning I mean to used that word as a plural to "itself". Then again for those who opposed "itselves" as a word can omit "itselves" by rewording the sentence with "itselves" in it and used "itself", however, words like each most be used to applied there are more then one.
For an example:
“Each of those moved on its own slow length along the desk."
Those or these can be use depending on the objects distance from the viewer mind. The word “its” is a singular and shows ownership by adding the “s” to the word.
“Sail boats are in the water next to me. Each of those moved itself slow length along the water.”
“The big sail boat and the tiny sail boat are next to me. Each one moved on its own slow length along, nearly missing me.”
February 5, 2011
Dontale commented on the word itselves
Itselves is the plural to itself. When using 'itselves' or 'itself' it can only refer to objects/things, and not essential beings. Because of the adjective rule. That is why when the subject noun of sentence is a person/animal/essential being you used 'myself' or 'themselves'. The adjective rule is: the adjective word being use is the object to the subject noun of the main sentence.
To fully understand this and where I am coming from I wrote this short analyzation called, "Their vs. It, by Ryan B. Lee".
'Their' can't be used as a adjective when the noun is an Object/thing. However, 'their' can be used as an adjective when the noun is a person or animal. Actually, only when subject noun is a person you used their, but I like to think it implies to essential beings/living creatures too.
'Their' definition:
"–pronoun
1.
a form of the possessive case of they used as an attributive adjective, before a noun: their home; their rights as citizens; their departure for Rome.
2.
(used after an indefinite singular antecedent in place of the definite masculine form his or the definite feminine form her ): Someone left their book on the table. Did everyone bring their lunch?", (dictionary.com).
By the definition of 'their' alone proved that it cannot refer back to an object/thing; unless, it is an essential being.
The major problems in the confusion of that word are:
1. When 'their' is used as a adjective it becomes an object to its subject noun. From this rule many misunderstood/confused this term adjective, because the adjective is the object to the subject noun when using 'their'. By thinking when 'their' becomes an adjective (object to the subject noun)many people have misinterpreted the subject noun can be an object when using 'their' as an adjective, from confusing these terms of an object when referring to 'their' as an adjective.
Research/References: http://www.wisc-online.com/Objects/ViewObject.aspx?ID=ESL1402 (2.4.11) , The New International Webster's Pocket Grammar & Speech & Style Dictionary of The English Language (c)1998, and The BRIEF ENGLISH HANDBOOK third edition by Edward A Dornan and Charles W.Dawe (c)1990
2. Another reason why people confuse 'their' when using it as an adjective is because they misread statement as, "Adjectives and adverbs in English do not change their forms to indicate person, number, or case. However, they do change their forms to indicate degrees of comparison", (P.111-112, The New International Webster's Pocket Grammar & Speech & Style Dictionary of The English Language). Meaning, adjectives, such as 'their', always stay as an object to the subject noun in the sentence it is in.
3. The word 'it' can replace adjectives, like 'their', but 'their' cannot be used as 'it' because when using the word 'it' usually refers to an object/thing and not an essential being. However, if 'it' does refer to an essential being then their maybe use, but when that happen you already replaced 'their' with 'it' so you just basically switching it back. To prove in how to use the word 'it' here is the definition of the word:
"it Show IPA pronoun, nominative it, possessive its or ( Obsolete or Dialect ) it, objective it; plural nominative they, possessive their or theirs, objective them; noun
–pronoun
1.
(used to represent an inanimate thing understood, previously mentioned, about to be mentioned, or present in the immediate context): It has whitewall tires and red upholstery. you can't tell a book by its cover.
2.
(used to represent a person or animal understood, previously mentioned, or about to be mentioned whose gender is unknown or disregarded): It was the largest ever caught off the Florida coast. who was it? It was John. The horse had its saddle on.
3.
(used to represent a group understood or previously mentioned): The judge told the jury it must decide two issues.
4.
(used to represent a concept or abstract idea understood or previously stated): It all started with Adam and Eve. He has been taught to believe it all his life.
5.
(used to represent an action or activity understood, previously mentioned, or about to be mentioned): Since you don't like it, you don't have to go skiing.
6.
(used as the impersonal subject of the verb to be, especially to refer to time, distance, or the weather): It is six o'clock. It is five miles to town. It was foggy.
7.
(used in statements expressing an action, condition, fact, circumstance, or situation without reference to an agent): If it weren't for Edna, I wouldn't go.
8.
(used in referring to something as the origin or cause of pain, pleasure, etc.): Where does it hurt? It looks bad for the candidate.
9.
(used in referring to a source not specifically named or described): It is said that love is blind.
10.
(used in referring to the general state of affairs; circumstances, fate, or life in general): How's it going with you?
11.
(used as an anticipatory subject or object to make a sentence more eloquent or suspenseful or to shift emphasis): It is necessary that you do your duty. It was a gun that he was carrying.
12.
Informal . (used instead of the pronoun its before a gerund): It having rained for only one hour didn't help the crops.
–noun
13.
(in children's games) the player called upon to perform some task, as, in tag, the one who must catch the other players.
14.
Slang .
a.
sex appeal.
b.
sexual intercourse.
—Idioms
15.
get with it, Slang . to become active or interested: He was warned to get with it or resign.
16.
have it, Informal .
a.
to love someone: She really has it bad for him.
b.
to possess the requisite abilities for something; be talented, adept, or proficient: In this business you either have it or you don't.
17.
with it, Slang .
a.
aware of the latest fads, fashions, etc.; up-to-date.
b.
attentive or alert: I'm just not with it early in the morning.
c.
understanding or appreciative of something, as jazz.
d.
Carnival Slang . being a member of the carnival.", (dictionary.com).
Therefore, the main reason why there is confusion on this topic is due to the misunderstanding that when 'their' becomes and adjective it is an object to the subject noun, which have to be an essential being; the subject noun is not an object when you use the words 'their', 'they', 'them', etc...
(A)"Improper installation of the shingles probably rendered them more susceptible to wind forces." WRONG
(A)"Improper installation of the shingles probably rendered it more susceptible to the wind forces." CORRECT
(B)"The shingles were probably rendered more susceptible to wind forces by their installation practices." WRONG
(B)"The shingles were probably rendered more susceptible to wind forces by its installation practices." CORRECT
(C)"Given their overall condition and the nature of their installation, the shingles were probably rendered more susceptible to wind forces." WRONG
(C)"Given its overall condition and the nature of its installation, the shingles were probably rendered more susceptible to the wind forces." CORRECT
February 5, 2011